AT&T and java pemissions/security for mobile phones

[Pablo A. Destefanis]

Hey guys,

Has anyone had any success in using the mobile forms in AT&T phones? These bastards disallow the use of the network for unsigned applications, which pretty much renders anything Java based THAT AT&T DOES NOT SELL unusable.

No, I don't buy that lie of "keeping our user safe" or "guaranteeing a quality experience". I would really like to find the people that write such nonsense.

Anyway, I digress. So far I have tested with other JVM, but the only one that worked under Windows Mobile was Esmertec's, and I'm still not sure if messages are going out (it says so, but I can't see them in FLSMS).

If anyone has any leads in this matter, it will be great. It's not only annoying for US-based users (to say the least), but it is keeping me from sending phones abroad, because of this lock.

Thank you,

Pablo

PS: Carriers, I hate you.

[Alex Anderson]

Hi Pablo,

I share your frustration - especially in the US, carrier lock-down makes J2ME a very restrictive platform to write applications for.

I notice you're using a WIndows Mobile phone. I wouldn't recommend these for FrontlineForms - as you've found, there are variations in JVMs, and they're not known to support SMS consistently. Your best bet may be to get hold of an unbranded (and therefore unlocked) handset off the list here: http://www.frontlinesms.com/forms

Hope that helps,

Alex

[Pablo A. Destefanis]

Hi Alex,

The phones listed there are usually branded, at least as sold in the US. As a matter of fact, it is becoming increasingly hard to find unbranded phones, or increasingly expensive, as branded=subsidized, but also branded=locked-in-several-ways.
I have some $10 Nokias that are useless for anything JVM-related, thanks again to the carrier.

If you know of any good source of unbranded phones, please let me know. I've been trying eBay, but can't find many any.

The situation can be different in the field (Mali, Uganda), but I think is moving in that direction.

Pablo

[Alex Anderson]

Hi Pablo,

Try http://www.expansys-usa.com/ or Amazon's unlocked phones department for starters.

Alex

[Tom Marentette]

Hi Alex and Pablo,

 

I'm having the same issue with getting forms to work with the "permissions" error. While using a Nokia 6650d, on AT&T, I get the following error message when going to "Get New Forms" --- "Permission Error - You must give this application permission to use networking. You man need to restart the app to allow this to happen."  I've tried every setting, but this appears to be AT&T lock on allowing Java app access to their network. Strange.

 

Is the fix to this to use an unlocked phone?  Will it still work with the AT&T SIM?

 

If I'm looking at unlocked phones is there a preferred model that I should seek for using with FrontlineForms?

 

On a separate note, I've been very successful in finding GSM modems that work.  I currently have three.  All of my testing has been updated on the Google form that Adam put together.

 

thanks to the FrontlineSMS team and user community for everything.

 

best,

Tom

[Pablo A. Destefanis]

To clarify: "unlocked" means that the phone can be used with any cellular provider, and not just one. That is different from other restrictions on the firmware/baseware of the phone. i.e. security settings in Java. That is part of the "branding" that most companies do.

Beyond installing applications that you never use, and access to their (garbage) content, sometimes they will restrict the phone in other ways, i.e. not allowing you tell you JVM to always allow connections, or to do so for certain types.
Sometimes, you can bypass that using a different JVM, but that's not an option if you are limited to the JVM installed in your branded phone. I.e. it's simple to add another JVM in a smartphone, it's hard to do in a non-smartphone (i.e. a Motorala RAZR).

So, that's the difference. If you want to look deeper, see how you can "mod" your phone, basically replacing the (crippled) firmware (and I refer to the ROM-based software too) with something else. There are many people doing that, but of course, they will do it mostly for "newer" phones. MoDoCo is a site that comes to mind.

Phones that you may purchase through smaller operators tend not to be branded, so that's another option. If you bought it though AT&T, Verizon, or anyone like that, most likely they have crippled it.

 

Cheers,

Pablo

[Tom Marentette]

Pablo,

 

Thanks for the clarification and tips.  I'm still a bit of a novice when it comes to these things and FrontlineForms, it also explains why I can't get this Nokia 6650d to pull in the FrontlineForm I created.  The application does not have permission to access the network, or something to that effect.  BTW - it is a branded AT&T phone.

 

thanks again and best regards,
Tom

[Pablo A. Destefanis]

If you are getting an error related to permissions, see if the JVM you have allows you to change that. That setting it's usually what these bastards block, but each case is different.

I don't have experience with the 6650, and I'm not sure if you can use another JVM. The other AT&T phone I used as a client for FLSMS was a Motorola KRZR, and that one will ask me for permission, and then send the SMS from FLSMS forms. Again, it's a bit of hit a miss, or maybe that newer models have that setting blocked.
Best of luck,

Pablo